SEAL's and the 17S

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  1. #1
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    SEAL's and the 17S

    Would like to report that SEAL Team 7 has received a new issue of FN SCAR 17S and are trying them out on San Clemente Island as I write with no complaints so far. They have been using the 16S for a little while now and with the exception of an initial complaint about a too short selector switch (since corrected by Magpul with a extended selector) seem happy. It is amazing that the Army and Marines still stick with what many consider the worst personal weapon (the M4 popgun) of the major advanced militaries in this world. Happily the USMC seems to be aggressively searching for an alternative.


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    Senior Member wesman66's Avatar
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    M4 - Worst?
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." Benjamin Franklin, 1759

    Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?”
    And I said, “Here am I. Send me!” Isaiah 6:8

  3. #3
    Senior Member joshua79109's Avatar
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    Re: SEAL's and the 17S

    Quote Originally Posted by Alesia
    Would like to report that SEAL Team 7 has received a new issue of FN SCAR 17S and are trying them out on San Clemente Island as I write with no complaints so far. They have been using the 16S for a little while now and with the exception of an initial complaint about a too short selector switch (since corrected by Magpul with a extended selector) seem happy. It is amazing that the Army and Marines still stick with what many consider the worst personal weapon (the M4 popgun) of the major advanced militaries in this world. Happily the USMC seems to be aggressively searching for an alternative.
    I have a good friend who retired recently who was a SEAL and used the SCAR-H in A-stan. They (his unit) never used the SCAR-L for anything real. I have another good friend who is a contractor who uses an M4 in A-Stan and has folks (Army) around him using the SCAR-H. Some of them had the SCAR-L, but they took them back from them according to him.

    There are still just as many folks who like the M4 as dislike them, if not more who like them. I'd be willing to make a good bet that the M4 isn't going anywhere soon for a couple of reasons.

    Glad to hear some other units are getting their hands on the SCAR.
    Joshua 24:14-15


    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke

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  5. #4
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    M4 the worst?

    I am not giving my personal view about the M4 but merely reporting what I hear around the NSWC in Coronado. The love affair with the M4 seems to be more an Army thing than a USMC or SEAL thing. Yes, I understand the large existing logistical infrastructure of Army Ordnance is a factor in keeping the M4. Many SEAL's think that the Brits with their HK made ‘second generation’ L85A2 have the most accurate rifle but the Germans with their G36 the most durable. Opinion is that the Aussies and the Brits may transition to a variant of the HK made G36 by 2016. I understand that British and Aussie special op’s have already traded in their M16 type weapons for a Special Op’s version of the G36. Now for my opinion if we could only get rid of the 5.56x45mm for a proper cartridge that would go a long way to making a better rifle.

  6. #5
    Senior Member joshua79109's Avatar
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    Re: M4 the worst?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alesia
    I am not giving my personal view about the M4 but merely reporting what I hear around the NSWC in Coronado. The love affair with the M4 seems to be more an Army thing than a USMC or SEAL thing. Yes, I understand the large existing logistical infrastructure of Army Ordnance is a factor in keeping the M4. Many SEAL's think that the Brits with their HK made ‘second generation’ L85A2 have the most accurate rifle but the Germans with their G36 the most durable. Opinion is that the Aussies and the Brits may transition to a variant of the HK made G36 by 2016. I understand that British and Aussie special op’s have already traded in their M16 type weapons for a Special Op’s version of the G36. Now for my opinion if we could only get rid of the 5.56x45mm for a proper cartridge that would go a long way to making a better rifle.
    So, what is your personal view?

    The things I hear seem to be opposite, but I'm hearing from those in Astan.
    Joshua 24:14-15


    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke

  7. #6
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    Well, I have an M4 but I also have a FN SCAR 16S and a SIG 556 but I only fire them on a range. If I had to go into battle I think I would choose the SCAR and the SIG a very close second (a little heavier) and leave the M4 at home. My boy has been a Navy SEAL officer for six years and has two deployments to Iraq and two to Af/Pak under his belt and thinks the M4 is crap but that is only his view while some of his men do like the M4. So who is to say? His view is that the M16A2 with a flat top is a much better weapon than the M4 since it has a longer barrel thus giving the round more retained energy downrange. He tells me the M4 was ok in Iraq where they mostly crashed buildings and did snatch jobs on bad guys and had Marines with heavy stuff as their QRT but in Af/Pak the ranges are often more extended and the M4 just doesn’t cut it.
    Actually, he likes the way the Brit Marines lavishly use L7A2’s (FN MAG in 7.62mm) but they are so heavy along with the ammo but then again Brit Marines are usually in phenomenal physical condition like no one else other than SEAL’s!

  8. #7
    Senior Member joshua79109's Avatar
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    All that makes sense. I keep in touch 5 guys over there and the 5 of them like the M4, but they say there are some who don't.

    I think they each have their place - the longer and shorter barrels.
    Joshua 24:14-15


    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke

  9. #8
    Senior Member Monolithman's Avatar
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    And when SEAL Team 7 get's some extra mags they want to sell, [NOT govt property] please put them in touch with us!! Our best to them.

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    I'd love to see some pics of that.

  11. #10
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    And SF dropped the 16, due to not enough benefits over the M4, but also is concentraiting on the 17.

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