Read This If you Bought A "Heavy Barrel" Off Gunbroker 5-15-2012 to 7-25-2012

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Thread: Read This If you Bought A "Heavy Barrel" Off Gunbroker 5-15-2012 to 7-25-2012

  1. #1
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    Read This If you Bought A "Heavy Barrel" Off Gunbroker 5-15-2012 to 7-25-2012

    Hello,

    I am new here but I thought I should share some information I recently learned.
    I bought an FNAR from a seller out of Missouri on July 9th off of Gunbroker.com.

    The item discription read:
    FNH USA FNAR FN AR 308 .308 Heavy Barrel NEW NIB

    I called FNH USA to confirm the model number because the identification label was missing from the box.
    FNH USA told me that my gun is a standard 20" barrel model!

    Please be advised that I spoke with the manager at the sellers store and she told me that it has been over a year since she has seen a Heavy Barrel FNAR in the store.

    Below is a list of completed auctions matching this item discription off of Gunbroker.com.
    I suggust that if you are on the list you give FNH USA a call to confirm the model of your gun using the serial number.


    User Auction # End Date
    Lyman Gun and Pawn 286793811 5/15/2012
    Cozy99 287329789 5/19/2012
    epage70 287955288 5/23/2012
    ssSix7 288306322 5/24/2012
    Alkibid 288559295 5/26/2012
    ls14jay 288586871 5/26/2012
    harknejg 288686654 5/27/2012
    C8H10N4O2 288708644 5/27/2012
    rick2112 288992320 5/29/2012
    matt_hew13 289866155 6/4/2012
    TEXSPORT 291788226 6/15/2012
    dan1959 292174685 6/18/2012
    brianbaru5964 292488321 6/20/2012
    JACKSBACKM16 293319101 6/26/2012
    notonfire 293414798 6/26/2012
    baker75 293567559 6/27/2012
    1RandomUser 294137515 7/1/2012
    brady25 295140648 7/7/2012
    da_buyer 295097304 7/7/2012
    israel66 295473139 7/9/2012
    grayling 295790010 7/11/2012
    welditnow 296479272 7/15/2012
    Spurrious 297034560 7/18/2012
    Stu1993 298009871 7/25/2012


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  3. #2
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    The heavy barrel is visibly tapered; the standard barrel is not.

    Joe

  4. #3
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    Hope they at least gave you a free mag or something for the mis-listing.

  5. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by scudzuki View Post
    The heavy barrel is visibly tapered; the standard barrel is not.

    Joe
    Did you mean that the other way? The standard/light tapers faster then the heavy with the same muzzle diameter.

    These are the spec #'s on 20" 20 RD guns from 2010-2012.

    Heavy 3108929100

    Standard 3108929250
    Last edited by emptybrass; 08-14-2012 at 12:29 PM.

  6. #5
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    The seller is yet to offer me an explination as to why the identification label was missing. When I informed him of the fact that according to the records of FNH USA the gun he sent me is a standard/light barrel. He replied that FNH USA has discontinued the heavy barrel and are now only producing the standard/light barrel model because the standard/light is more accurate.
    When I visited the FNH USA website I noticed that only the 20" heavy barrel and the 16" standard are advertized.

    The seller is telling me that the FNH USA website is wrong, and a light barrel is more accurate than a heavy barrel.

    I would think that if they were going to discontinue a model it would be the light/standard version.
    From my expirence a heavier (and therefore more ridgid) barrel is always going to be more stable (and therefore more accurate).

    Can anybody confirm which model has been discontinued?

  7. #6
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    The light 20 has been discontinued. The 2012 catalog only has the 20" heavy and the 16" standard. 4 models total. Only difference is 10rd or 20rd in each version

    As for which is more accurate. Doesn't matter both hold the same accuracy specification.
    israel66 thanked this.

  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by emptybrass View Post
    Did you mean that the other way? The standard/light tapers faster then the heavy with the same muzzle diameter.

    These are the spec #'s on 20" 20 RD guns from 2010-2012.

    Heavy 3108929100

    Standard 3108929250
    I own a standard barrel 20" rifle.
    The barrel is .768" diameter until about 6" forward of the breech, at least on the rifle I own, as verified by a set of calipers.
    The heavy barrel is approximately the same diameter at the muzzle as the standard and tapers larger towards the breech. There is no cylindrical (un tapered) section of the barrel on the heavy barrelled model except possibly around the chamber.

    Joe
    Last edited by scudzuki; 08-14-2012 at 04:10 PM. Reason: clarification

  9. #8
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    Hey Israel..
    Non of this makes a damn bit of difference. You NEED to communicate to the seller RIGHT NOW to either send you the rifle you paid for, return your money to you, or whatever else you're wanting done to make this right.
    You gotta stop letting them control the situation by simply floating a bunch of B.S. your way.
    The Bottom Line is you bought the rifle from them because they listed it as a HEAVY BARREL FNAR. For arguement's sake, say FN stopped making the H-Bar.. So what? That's NOT what you bought and PAID FOR, and the situation needs to be rectified ASAP. Thankfully FN still makes the H-Bar, so dude owes it to you. You need to give him a VERY SHORT amount of time to rectifiy it, then you need to get GB and/or your credit card company involved(hopefully you used a CC, as they're the safest way to pay for stuff over the internet-Amex in particular). I don't know when you bought the thing, but usually you only have TWO billing cycles to dispute a charge in, i.e. 60 DAYS. If you're close to that now, DISPUTE THE CHARGE NOW. Hopefully you saved the auction page, or GB can pull it back up for you.
    The ONLY thing you and the seller need to talk about at this point is when you are either gonna get your money back, or the CORRECT rifle.
    FWIW, FN has discounted the standard barrel $400 or so. I just bought one BNIB for $924, with the plan of simply replacing the thing with an H-Bar when I need to.
    FN DIDN'T discount the H-Bar version(s), so if you paid $1400+/-, you need to get especially pissed off. Either way, the item you bought was mis-represented, and in fact, there's a name for what the seller did.
    It's called 'Bait And Switch'.
    Get it handled before you run out of time and/or resources.
    israel66 and Vfin thanked this.

  10. #9
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    Now that you mention it, I think you may be spot on with the Bait and switch call.
    I noticed the first red flag when I arrived at my transfer dealer’s shop and opened up the package from UPS. The box inside the UPS box looked like a factory box but the identification label was missing and it appeared as though the box had been opened and resealed. Also, I did not think much of it at that moment but there was a UPS shipping label on the factory box showing that the gun had been shipped from a man I will just refer to as Mr. Baker (to protect his identity) from Oregon to the sellers shop in Missouri.
    The next red flag came when I got home and I pulled the FN case out of the factory box and a photo copy of Mr. Baker’s driver’s license fell out onto the floor. I picked it up and noticed a note saying “thanks for the help”.
    At this point I was thinking well maybe a dealer to dealer sale took place between Mr. Baker and the seller. I did a search on the BATF website (since I had all of Mr. Baker’s personal information!) to see if he was a licensed dealer. I did not find any record of a licensed dealer with his name in Oregon.
    At this point I was suspicious.
    I read the owner’s manual and decided I would perform the initial cleaning in order to get more familiar with the construction of the firearm. When I disassembled the gas system I was surprised to find the gas piston well blackened with powder residue. My examination of the gun also revealed brass marks on the bottom of the carrier and the bolt face.
    Now I was concerned that I had been sent a used gun by mistake.
    I contacted the seller several times by email with an explanation of what I had discovered I included photographs of the gun parts and a scanned image of Mr. Baker’s license. When he finally responded to me he said “that gun was sent to another customer by mistake and he returned it the same day” and “the fouling is from the proof testing”.
    I thought the amount of fouling to be excessive for a proof test so I called FNH USA. They told me that they fire 1-3 proof rounds through the guns and the fouling is normal. So, that laid to rest my concern about the fouling (for the moment). Then, while I had them on the phone I mentioned that there was no identification label and I asked them to run the serial number for me. I was very surprised and upset when they told me that my gun was a 20” standard w/20rd. mag!
    Again I contacted the seller and again no response to my email. So, I ended up calling the shop and talking to the manager. This is when she told me she had not had a 20” Heavy Barrel FNAR come through the store in “like a year”. She told me that the listing must have been created by accident by one of the employees. (I knew from looking at their listings on Gunbroker that they were using the listing with HEAVY BARREL in the title currently and for as far back as I could search completed auctions). At this point I had absolutely no trust in this seller.
    She acknowledged that the gun was not the correct model. I asked when I could expect for them to have one in stock. In the background I heard the owner say “Never!”
    She said I could send the gun back for a full refund (and I was going to go with this option) but, then she sent me a message saying “when the gun is received in new condition you will receive a full refund”. Maybe I am too cautious but after I saw that I thought NO WAY. I could just see them getting it back and nit picking at it and reducing my full refund down to 70 or 80%. Plus I don’t even really consider that I received the gun in new condition. It was sent to another customer, removed from the box, the identification label was gone, it had powder residue build up, it was sent back to the seller, and then to me. I don’t think that anybody would still consider something to be factory new after it had been unpackaged by another customer and then returned missing some original documentation.
    I played nice with them the whole time and I got them to send me 3 extra 20 round mags.
    When I got the mags I left them a “D” for feedback and called it good.
    When I saw that they left me a “D” also I was mildly annoyed but, chalked it up to childishness.
    Then this week I received an email demanding that I change the feedback to positive. I refused and they got nasty with me using foul language and personal insults.
    I would be interested to hear from others on the list (especially baker75) to hear their stories.
    I will be filing a complaint with the BBB in Missouri.




  11. #10
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    Do their current listings still list "heavy barrel"? My feeling is that, if it was an honest mistake they should have taken the gun back and refunded you no questions asked, shot or not. After all they mis-listed the gun. Unless you were a FNAR expert there was no way for you to know off the bat if it was a heavy or not without some time and research and most would have taken it for granted(probably what they were hoping).

    Now the question of, are you happy with the gun you got at the price you got it? If so, you got a good deal with the gun, especially with 3 extra mags (about 160 bucks worth). If you are dead set on a Heavy, then fight on. If not, I think your course of action will be sufficient, and hopefully change their ways.

    BigRat

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