Ammo Selection For SCAR 17S / SpecterDR 1x/4x

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Thread: Ammo Selection For SCAR 17S / SpecterDR 1x/4x

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    Ammo Selection For SCAR 17S / SpecterDR 1x/4x

    Hello All, I am a new member here. I have not been able to find this exact topic discussed anywhere. I have a SCAR 17S with an Elcan SpecterDR 1x/4x. The manual that comes with the 7.62 calibrated SpecterDR 1x/4x says that the reticle is calibrated for 147gr 7.62x51mm.

    My question is, if I wanted to use something besides 147gr or 149gr "M80", what would be the best, most accurate, round to use that will still allow me to use the reticle out to 400, 500, and 600yrds?

    Could I use Federal 150gr boat tailed FMJ? Would something like that allow me to keep the 100 yard zero and hit right on at 600 without having to figure out a hold over? Can I go up to 155gr and achieve this? I wanna use the reticle out to 600, and I want all of them to be right on. What ammo will allow me to do this?????

    Thanks for your help.

    Steven
    Last edited by evensteven; 01-11-2016 at 08:02 PM.


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    Senior Member USGILT's Avatar
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    I had the very same scope (7.62 reticle) on my SCAR17s.

    You've pretty much answered your own questions concerning the practicality of BDC reticles. They work under specific conditions with specific loads, but are not a replacement for proper adjustments when precision is needed.

    BDC reticles accomplish one thing: They provide sufficient accuracy when speed of engagement with the least amount of necessary thought is the greatest concern. For shooters looking for 2-3 MOA accuracy under stressful or rapid conditions, they are absolutely sufficient. We're talking half to full size IPSC / man size targets, etc. A trick to get better accuracy from a BDC reticle is to zero towards the furthest extent of the expected target engagement. For example, if you're going to shoot out to 500 yards, zero at the 400 yard stata. This reduces tolerance stacking issues at distance.

    I shot all types of M80 ball and everything over 200 yards out to 600 yards that I shot had a change in POI from the correct reticle stata line. I had to shoot each yardage and record the holdover difference in order to make consistent hits.

    I will say 168gr OTM rounds were closer to the reticle but still not dead on.
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    Thank you, man. I underestimated what the change in POI would be with minimal differences in bullet weights/shooting conditions at long range. Once you made your way out to 600 and were able to make consistent hits, was there a change in your POI at 100yards, or was it still point-of-aim/point-of-impact? If there was a change, then I would just have to keep it zeroed at 100.

    I put this rifle together to be a "heavy battle rifle", hoping to be able to use the reticle to hit a man sized target out to 600 without having to estimate a holdover. I typically get 2-2.5 MOA at 100 yards with the 149gr "XM80CL", so I guess I will have to settle for hitting in the general vicinity of a really fat guy at 600.

    I will try to get it zeroed as far out as possible with M80, then figure out what the typical holdovers are at 400-600 with 168gr match.

    Thanks again for the insight. That really helped a lot.
    Last edited by evensteven; 01-12-2016 at 04:52 PM.

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    image.png

    This should help get you there. Or atleast in theory anyway...

    Google search JBM Ballistics for an online ballistic calculator if you don't already have one, and fill in the necessary information pertaining to your rifle/load. It will give you a bullet drop chart to reference and compare the above info to. Keep in mind that they won't line up exactly because the Elcan reticle is made to be a blend of a few different weight rounds so troops can use whatever ammo is readily available and still get hits. You're not going to be shooting golf balls at 600 yards with it...

    You'll have to thank USGILT for the reticle data. He posted it a while back. Good stuff.
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    Senior Member USGILT's Avatar
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    So I broke out one of my older data books but could only find my surplus M80 ball data out to 400 yards but you will get the gist.

    11/01/2014 – Elk River Trng Ctr, TN
    Average temp 36-40 degrees
    Elevation – 1,024
    Ammo – 147gr FMJ Lithuanian M80 Ball – chronograph average velocity of 2,732fps
    Event: Appleseed Full Distance AQT
    Target size - 25"w x 18.75"h

    Not my target but you get a rough idea of the size of the target.


    100 yards – dead on POA/POI
    200 yards – 4” high with 200 reticle so I used the 100 yard reticle to achieve center hits on target
    300 yards – 7” high with 300 reticle so I used the 200 yard reticle to achieve center hits on target
    400 yards – 15” completely off target used the 300 yard reticle and split the difference between 300-400 stada lines to achieve center hits on target

    With M80 ball after 100 yards all shots vertical dispersion increased with each known distance target range. With 168gr OTM rounds my ballistic curve was not as severe and closer to the BDC reticle at distance.

    For 168 FGMM I averaged 2487 fps
    For Hornady 155 OTM Match I averaged 2577 fps

    I had excellent accuracy with both rounds. Muzzle velocity isn't everything at longer ranges BC is more important!
    Last edited by USGILT; 01-12-2016 at 09:19 PM.
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    Senior Member FullAssault's Avatar
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    This is what I'm getting with IMI M80 it's pretty close to what I'm getting in the real world.



    I avg. around 1.5-2.5" with the IMI ammo. I get the best & most consistent groups with 168gr Hdy (.75"-1.25" but it's not as close on the DR's BDC )




    168gr Hdy SP
    Last edited by FullAssault; 01-14-2016 at 02:30 PM.
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    FullAssault, what app is that? I likey.

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    Wow, thank you to all of you. I do get the gist, USGILT. Thanks for the data. I guess since the reticle is designed to be used with varying bullet weights, it will be pretty close at distance, just not dead on. I will definitely be able to remember that M80 hits high from 200-400, and to use the next shorter stata line. Maybe at, say, 400 yards and beyond, it would behoove ones self to switch over to a 168gr match load. Thanks again.

    That is a cool app, Full Assault. Thanks for the tip.
    Last edited by evensteven; 01-13-2016 at 03:44 PM.
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    Senior Member FullAssault's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cadster View Post
    FullAssault, what app is that? I likey.
    Strelok pro
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    Thanks for the help.

    17S.jpg
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